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Corrosive
11-28-2008, 06:05 PM
OK, here's one to throw out to you all. Having finally agreed on a site design for our design business and found out what kind of leaves we have on our pages (thanks Rob) I am getting down to trying to promote it.

We want to work fairly locally. I think I am doing all the right things to get our site to come up in local searches but am not having the best results.

This guy

http://www.fouracrewebdesign.co.uk

Comes up everywhere but if you look down his website he's stuffed the foot of each page with loads of words.

I don't want to be resorting to tricks like that but want a good local ranking. Any suggestions guys?

Site is in my sig btw.

cocoonfx
11-29-2008, 12:31 AM
It's going to take a little time to bed in. Like a good wine needs to mature.

Add yourself to all local online directories, see if you can create a small network i.e graphic designers, web hosts, copy writers, production companies etc.. and link your site to them and get them to link to you. Google Business Ads are good and free. Make sure the wording in your site matches the keywords. i.e my site = Web Design Tamworth. I then make sure i have plenty of references to this as well.

It is a lot of work but it will pay off.

edbr
11-29-2008, 02:02 AM
dont under estimate age of site, it makes a big difference,some of my top local competitors have some site that seem to do everything wrong but hit the top lists always.
look at http://www.freewebsubmission.com/web-page-analyzer.html

it give an online guide to stuff like density of description to page content for example. and rates elements of your pages. of course not perfect but as a guide I find it helps.

Corrosive
11-29-2008, 08:46 AM
dont under estimate age of site, it makes a big difference,some of my top local competitors have some site that seem to do everything wrong but hit the top lists always.
look at http://www.freewebsubmission.com/web-page-analyzer.html

it give an online guide to stuff like density of description to page content for example. and rates elements of your pages. of course not perfect but as a guide I find it helps.

Thanks guys. Sounds like I am doing the right things but the site needs to have been around for a while longer to really start to see a difference. Might have to resort to some good old foot canvasing for a bit.

Corrosive
12-01-2008, 06:44 PM
Thanks guys. Sounds like I am doing the right things but the site needs to have been around for a while longer to really start to see a difference. Might have to resort to some good old foot canvasing for a bit.

OK, I have seen on some sites that a page has been repeated a few times but with a different location in the title, description and content. I.e. I might have my web design page a few times in the site but with a different location title. So, 'Web Designer in Bristol' and 'Web Designer in Bath' are the same page with different titles. I would put each location in the content as well.

Question is...good idea, bad idea or not making any sense at all?

Cheers all :)

Rob_Che
12-01-2008, 10:16 PM
I think that headers / titles get priority in SEO so it would make sense. I don't think there is anythng wrong with having a description (in text) in your footer though as longit's not gratuitous.

"YOTO Creative - designs for business, covering: Bath, Bristol (&^(^% and the Avon. Coming in your ears" etc...

DoMedia is the man though... He probably knows that algorithms,,,

domedia
12-02-2008, 02:52 PM
DoMedia is the man though... He probably knows that algorithms,,, Yeah I wish.. knowledge about those alogs are worth mucho money these days.

Corrosive, the site you listed above has been around for a while, so everyone's pretty much spot on in my opinion.

I do not think he benefits anything from stuffing keywords on the bottom of his site, it does not make his pages more relevant.

He is enjoying inbound links from sites in his portfolio though for some time, and you just gave him a new one above ;-) .

I think in the simplest form possible you can boil SEO down to two items.
1. Make semantically sound accessible documents
2. Implement a good marketing plan that involves a link strategy.

Kelon
12-22-2008, 11:29 PM
Hi - I know this thread is old now but if my experience helps...
Yes, validated clean code... dymanic sites are less search robot friendly
Use Googles adword tool to suggest ideas for keywords (you don't need to commit to adwords to use it)
Document titles and h1, h2 seem in my observation to have profound affects including the naming of files: graphic-design-somerset.html .. yep for real.
Get yourself Googles (quietly listed) webmaster tools - not 'Analytics', search about it's there - where it shows you what searches your site has actually been offered to... real interesting what that tells you about who's looking for what and finding your site... whether it matches, so whether you're getting anywhere near if you follow.
Avoid, avoid, avoid anything Google will see as being trickie-dickie.
Should be number one... update, update, update and update (not design or pictures, not looks at all, but content). Best way to get listed high...There you go... knock yourselves out.

Corrosive
12-23-2008, 08:34 AM
Hi - I know this thread is old now but if my experience helps...
Yes, validated clean code... dymanic sites are less search robot friendly
Use Googles adword tool to suggest ideas for keywords (you don't need to commit to adwords to use it)
Document titles and h1, h2 seem in my observation to have profound affects including the naming of files: graphic-design-somerset.html .. yep for real.
Get yourself Googles (quietly listed) webmaster tools - not 'Analytics', search about it's there - where it shows you what searches your site has actually been offered to... real interesting what that tells you about who's looking for what and finding your site... whether it matches, so whether you're getting anywhere near if you follow.
Avoid, avoid, avoid anything Google will see as being trickie-dickie.
Should be number one... update, update, update and update (not design or pictures, not looks at all, but content). Best way to get listed high...There you go... knock yourselves out.

Thanks Kelon. I think that this is all good advice. I try and keep my docs correctly marked up and I use webmaster tools all the time. I am going to say something slightly odd though...

Google doesn't appear to be as smart as it says or a lot of people think it is. Granted, in the early says I had some sites banned for keyword stuffing etc. but I still see folks 'getting away' with some practices which Google should be stopping if it is THAT clever.

Honestly, I think it has become a Beomoth which no one is quite sure how to control. I have started turning to Yahoo for my searches as I seem to get 'cleaner' results with a lot less trash thrown in.

Just my observations form the last few weeks really.

Kelon
12-23-2008, 12:55 PM
Just my observations....

Thank you Corrosive, I'm always interested in people's observations. You may well be right in the points you make. However, with the websites I've had a continuing involvement with... generally concerned with SEO and traffic tracking. I've found most visitors finding websites through searches are still coming through Google. There may well be a trend away toward Yahoo, I've not observed it myself, but perhaps I've not been looking.

I'm intrigued by what you mean when you say yahoo gives you cleaner results... clean of what?

I'm also interested in how you're judging that a site is genuinely long-term 'getting away with it'. Personally when a website is associated with generating revenue for my client, I'm taking no chances and I've got good results without being Dickie so that's how I personlly do things. It's not necessarily the only way to do things.

Particularly interesting thread this one.

Corrosive
12-23-2008, 01:11 PM
Thank you Corrosive, I'm always interested in people's observations. You may well be right in the points you make. However, with the websites I've had a continuing involvement with... generally concerned with SEO and traffic tracking. I've found most visitors finding websites through searches are still coming through Google. There may well be a trend away toward Yahoo, I've not observed it myself, but perhaps I've not been looking.

I'm intrigued by what you mean when you say yahoo gives you cleaner results... clean of what?

I'm also interested in how you're judging that a site is genuinely long-term 'getting away with it'. Personally when a website is associated with generating revenue for my client, I'm taking no chances and I've got good results without being Dickie so that's how I personlly do things. It's not necessarily the only way to do things.

Particularly interesting thread this one.

Will try and clear up what I mean.

I don't think there is a move away from Google by the masses it's just what I have found for getting the info I want and quickly. People will always use Google, Why not when you get such great tools like webmaster, local business centre, adwords etc? And it is the SE I concentrate on the most because most people use it.

What I mean by cleaner results from Yahoo is that what I want is less 'spread out' amongst results which are not relevant to the search terms I used. Whatever they are doing (or Google is not doing) means a more focussed search. I have no hard evidence but it is changing my searching habits a bit (probably sub-consciously).

As for the rest, have a look at the site I quoted at the start of this thread and see what you reckon. Stuffed with keywords (may or may not make a difference but certainly should be ignored as not written in a 'readable' or 'helpful' way) and he has a number of pages imply targeted at locations with little else in the way of content.

See what you reckon to it.

edbr
12-24-2008, 12:48 AM
just an aside, i was told though have seen no proof , there is a marked increase in Asia towards Yahoo including of course then ppc results

edbr
12-24-2008, 12:58 AM
on the subject of seo this is a quote from a newsletter with a few points for consideration. Maybe
1) Use a Keyword Rich Domain Name:
It is widely believed that if you include your keywords in your domain name like www.professional-website-design-in-nj.com (http://www.professional-website-design-in-nj.com/) it will greatly increase your rankings. This is not true. It is best to choose a domain name that is short, easy to remember and if possible includes your company name.
2) Google Partnership:
If you are ever approached by a company claiming to have a partnership with Google, run in the opposite direction. There is no such thing as a "preferred" relationship with Google and in fact on Google's website it even states: Beware of SEOs that claim to guarantee rankings, allege a "special relationship" with Google, or advertise a "priority submit" to Google.
3) Meta Keyword Tag:
It used to be that the Meta Keyword Tag was given a lot of weight in the early days of Search Engine Optimization, but people abused it and now it does very little. You may still want to include your keywords here, but know that it will not do much and in fact most search engines won't even check it.
4) Bold or Italicized Text:
Adding emphasis to certain keywords like using bold or italics can make your text easier to scan for the reader if done properly, but has little to no affect on your search engine ranking.
5) Content Length:
There is no search engine rule stating that your content needs to be a specific number of words in order to get indexed. Any recommended length is more to assist the reader in understanding what you do than to aid the search engines.
6) Duplicate Content:
Posting specific content like an article or blog entry on your site and then on another site will not get you penalized. In the search results, Google will recognize that the content is the same and only choose one of the pages to display, but it will not hurt your overall search engine ranking.
7) Avoid Flash:
Any text that you place in Flash will not be readable by a search engine, but this doesn't mean you have to avoid flash altogether. You can still very successfully incorporate Flash into your site through rotating pictures or a header on the page. Just don't have an all Flash site or use a Flash intro if you are interested in increasing your search engine rankings.

edbr
12-24-2008, 12:59 AM
and heres part 2
8) Pay-Per-Click:
Some say that using Pay-Per-Click will help your organic listing while others say it will hurt. Both are false. The fact is that Google has gone to great lengths to separate the two departments of organic and paid listings to a point where the two departments don't communicate or even sit at the same table for lunch.
9) Update the Site Frequently:
Updating your site often is a good idea if you have something new to say. Just don't change around a few words to accommodate the search engines as that won't help your listing at all. Regularly adding legitimate content like articles, press releases and blog entries will help though.
10) Doorway Pages:
Many companies will sell this idea of increasing your ranking by creating hundreds of one page sites loaded with keywords that link to you from various domains. This is considered spamming the search engine and is not recommended. If you properly optimize your site and focus on the correct way to get listed, you will increase your ranking much quicker than these doorway pages ever could.

coloeagle
12-30-2008, 12:21 AM
I tend to spend some time following Dave's SEO Blog (http://www.huomah.com/)
He tells it how it is without all the hype and mystery.